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Posts: 1585
Jul 24 09 1:32 PM
Posts: 11485
Jul 24 09 7:36 PM
Jul 27 09 5:59 PM
Natrlhorse I DO appreciate your comments and suggestions As far as him rating his speed based on my motion, this is one of the other issues I am working on with Justin. He is extremely sensitive to all movement on the part of the rider BUT he interprets all rider motion (legs or seat, weight shifting, hands, contact) as "You want me to trot/canter as hard and fast as I possibly can? Sure! I can move out! Sure! I can do that! See! See! (trottrottrotrottrot…)" He is sort of stuck in high gear, similar in some ways to a poorly ridden barrel horse... It goes without saying then that he also doesn't move off of pressure very, his automatic response is to press into legs pressure. So we also work on lots of forehand and hindquarter pivots. The last two days, we have also been working on leg yields at a walk, relaxed but expecting the hind legs to cross over nicely and staying straight. These have been going pretty well- he is beginning to figure out that leg pressure is not default a cue for more forward motion.
I am not cantering the whole time, there is also a lot of trotting and walking. My tendency would be to just never canter at all so this is to keep me motivated to actually work on cantering, but I should probably document some of the non-cantering stuff also.
Three rides have passed since my last entry- Friday (day 5)- Very similar to Thursday, only I was expecting him to start off well and then start to rush again. So, when Justin starting rushing into a hurried and out of control canter, we worked on trotting instead for about 20 minutes and then went back to the canter. At a trot, we are working on moving the shoulder in and out during serpentines (as in, moving flexed in the same direction as the turn and flexed counter to the direction of turn). The key seems to be not trying to go in one direction too long right now. We then went back to canter-stop-canter. He is increasing the number of non-rushed cantering steps dramatically.
Sat (day6)- This was the best day yet. There were many incidences of Justin picking up a very relaxed canter, going for about 5 strides, and then stopping quietly. We did this by going up the center of the paddock cantering (with several s top/starts) and then leg yielding from the fence towards the center of the paddock, and back again..
(didn't on Sunday, had to move round bales *sob*)
Monday (today) (day 7) Similar in a lot of ways to Sat- lots of canter-stop-canter-stop down one length of the paddock followed by leg yields at a walk going the other direction. He can do flexing in either direction at a trot but not leg yields yet. I want him to be relaxed and straight through his body while doing leg yields. These sessions of behaving sane and rational are sprinkled with incidences of him launching into a lurching/thrusting trot or launching into a high powered, out of control canter. It is somewhat discouraging. I have to be careful to put enough pressure on him so he is progressing, but not so much pressure that he slips back into his default habits.
One thing that this has made me aware of is that he is actually trying hard to figure out what I want from him. He anticipates horribly. If I pick up a canter two times in a row next to a certain cone, the third time we pass that cone, he gets anxious and tries to canter. So that is a new conundrum- horses do best with some routine but if he thinks he knows already what I am going to ask, his mind turns off of me and he just does it (does that make sense?)
Posts: 878
Jul 28 09 6:28 AM
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Posts: 3287
Jul 28 09 8:21 PM
Jul 29 09 5:59 PM
Jul 30 09 6:58 PM
Aug 2 09 5:38 AM
Day 10 (Sat- yesterday). Another good ride- same program (started of at w/t with flexing, stopping, and circles, then canter work with w/t episodes). Canter departures are getting much softer. One symptom of his increased softness is that he picks up the correct lead about 90% of the time now where as before he always picked up the wrong lead (his body tensed and moved in the opposite direction of where he was asked). I have not been "working" on leads and I do not correct him when he doesn't pick up the lead I want. He is picking up the correct lead because of the softness and willingness in his body and mind and because I am careful to time the departure cue when his weight is ready.
Now, he starts off cantering in a more controlled fashion (I am defining this as cantering softly on a completely loose rein (zero contact) at a reasonable speed, ready to listen to a new cue). After a while, something will trigger him to go back into resistance mode. This is because the new habit of cantering in control is not well-established (only a few rides as compared to years and years).
In the first few rides, which started out with the cantering pattern "Resistance Resistance Resistance Control (stop the ride)" it was important to work in the Control state long enough to develop and reinforce it, but not so long to pass right through it and back into Resistance.
At this point, he starts out cantering in control so the envelop is pushed not by just stopping after the first few canter exercises (which are all under control) but to go ahead and let him get resistant again (which is natural, at this point because he has had so many more years being resistant) and then working him through it.
So the new riding pattern is Control Control Control Resistance Control (stop the ride). I am expecting him to work through the resistance mode and back into controlled mode before the ride is finished. The expectation is that he is always going to have a tendency to get into Resistance mode and we need lots of practice switching back into control mode.
It is analogous to a spooky horse- a spooky horse learns courage not by being coddled and kept away from spooky situations but by constantly being exposed to something just over the spooky limit and successfully dealing with it. The trick is to provide just enough challenge, just over the comfort line, without overwhelming.
Another note: when to end the ride. Yesterday was the first day also that we ended the ride with a cool down at a walk. In all previous rides, we ended when he was cantering under control and stopping particularly well. Even though he was hot and breathing hard, I just got off and hand walked him to cool him.
(Will go ride this morning)
Aug 2 09 10:22 AM
Aug 6 09 1:24 PM
Posts: 4022
Aug 6 09 1:49 PM
reditoride wrote: Ride 14. Justin is beginning to really regulate his own speed. Yesterday, we went on a trail ride to feed the neighbors dog. We trotted (w/o contact of course) most of the way. There were several times where he started building momentum but before I had to correct him, he corrected himself and checked back down to a nice, easygoing working trot.
Aug 6 09 2:17 PM
fireweedak wrote: reditoride wrote: Ride 14. Justin is beginning to really regulate his own speed. Yesterday, we went on a trail ride to feed the neighbors dog. We trotted (w/o contact of course) most of the way. There were several times where he started building momentum but before I had to correct him, he corrected himself and checked back down to a nice, easygoing working trot. Awwww! Good work! Thanks for sharing!
Aug 7 09 6:42 AM
Aug 21 09 4:43 AM
Aug 29 09 12:45 PM
Sep 20 09 5:18 AM
In the last 17 days since I reported here, I have only been able to ride Justin five times. (This is because we bought a nice APHA show horse for my daughter and we have been spending all of our time at her trainers where he is being kept. He is a nice horse, with a great mind, but is a bit too technical for a 13 year old to school by herself at home and the days of me being able to offer her "constructive advice" that is not followed by the statement "Mom! You are not helping!" are over. More importantly though, he is much more advanced then my own skill and so they need professional help.)
So rides 20 through 24. Not very many rides in such a long period of time but they were really good rides.
Significant advancements: The most significant advancement has been in controlling Justin's hindquarter. We had been doing very half-assed-not-really-leg-yields because his shoulders were leading. Until you have control of the hind quarter, there will never be control at a canter.
Three requirements needed to be met to deal with this. One is consistent movement away from leg pressure behind the girth. Second is that the inside leg is supporting keeping the shoulder straight. Over both of these cues, and one of the cruxes of Justin's whole issues, it that Justin need to respond to cues for lateral movement and control of the shoulder without simultaneously interpreting these as cues for an increase in forward movement. It is clear that this last point has never been made to him.
Starting from the easiest move controlling the hindquarter- lots of turns on the forehand, 360o, both directions. Then, trying haunches in and haunches out, keeping my eyes fixed on a post to maintain straight forward movement. These are still piss-poor, with only the faintest hint (one or two steps) of a real haunches in or out. Finally, leg yields. These are easiest to do on trails leg yeilding between tire tracks. Trying to keep forward and sideways, with the hind quarter movement not falling behind the shoulder.
A side effect of this has been that Justin has really picked up sidepassing very well. I can now stop him any where and side pass left or right.
So now I have decent leg yields in the quiver of exercises to use to bring Justin's mind back to me when he gets over-excited.
What about cantering? We have been expanding Justin's cantering zone to include long stretches of cantering on the trail. I cantered him about a mile, on a loose rein the whole time. We stopped a few times and made sure his mind was still on me by leg yielding at a walk. He was very relaxed and did not attempt to pick up excessive speed.
Finally, a real test of the difference this training regime has had on him. I took Justin to a playday series my kids compete in. I had ridden Justin in it before, with disastrous results. He was, to put it mildly, extremely unmanageable (bolting, cantering sideways, one time literally running away with me out the alleyway and through the crowded parking lot). We were DQ-ed from numerous classes for either breaking the timer line or breaking the pattern. Putting better playday riders then myself on him did not help. Pretty much demonstrating the behaviors that got him abandoned by his previous jumper owners to begin with.
Last night was a 100% change. We went in five classes. All I can say is he was really with me the whole time. He was "between my legs" no attempt to go off course, very responsive. After the timer line, I could just say "whoa" and he stopped and walked out of the arena. I did not ask for speed, nor did I try to keep him excessively checked. Just a fluid canter (with big turns for now) around the different patterns. It was awesome and I am really stoked.
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Sep 20 09 10:25 AM
Sep 21 09 6:45 PM
Oct 29 09 12:22 PM
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Oct 31 09 9:16 AM
crazyhorseer wrote: I'm going to make a few suggestions. Mind you this is more of a classical dressage approach. Do not put your hands on his whithers, raise them and just let your elbows hang at your side, hands up. This allows you to sit up and back while your hands still rock and follow much more loosely with Justin. Also, no see-sawing him to slow down. Lift up, not pull back in a give-take, pulling back and putting hands down will tilt your pelvis forward into a driving seat. If you sit back on your butt and lift your hands and body, you will sit deeper and help him off his forehand. Definitely lots of walk-canter-walk transitions, a few strides, not even a full circle. To ask for a walk, you should first give the reins, not haul him downwards, but teach him he can return to a nice forward walk. While cantering, loose rein, let him learn to carry himself for the short while that he is. Cantering round and round does nothing, transitions will teach him to rock back and pay attention, along with rewarding a non strung-out nutsy canter. I would warm up with a lot of trot work, just on the buckle until he settles, and then work on some lateral work before beginning canter transitions.
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