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Posts: 150
May 2 08 9:05 AM
Posts: 6812
May 2 08 9:13 AM
TrickRoperDeluxe wrote: Fetlock Up wrote: TrickRoperDeluxe wrote: Have you ever used a chain bit? They are quite possibly one of the kindest bits out there. The chain conforms to the horses mouth , its really not that harsh. Are you high? Chain bits are NASTY! People use chain bits when they want an extra amount of bite. Chain bits are very capable of cutting up a horse's lips and bars. The ONLY cut tongues I have ever seen have been from chain bits. I would NEVER use a chain bit and there is no possible way they can be considered kind. Have you ever used on? I used to feel the same way until I kept hitting wall after wall with my Arab gelding. Bought one , tried to hurt my arm with it an couldnt. In order to be able to actually cut up a mouth they would have to have sharp edges or some sort of distortion to them (like a twisted wire does) They are kind because they conform to the mouth , the only thing not great about them is they kinda hang vs. setting up on the bars of the mouth.
Fetlock Up wrote: TrickRoperDeluxe wrote: Have you ever used a chain bit? They are quite possibly one of the kindest bits out there. The chain conforms to the horses mouth , its really not that harsh. Are you high? Chain bits are NASTY! People use chain bits when they want an extra amount of bite. Chain bits are very capable of cutting up a horse's lips and bars. The ONLY cut tongues I have ever seen have been from chain bits. I would NEVER use a chain bit and there is no possible way they can be considered kind.
TrickRoperDeluxe wrote: Have you ever used a chain bit? They are quite possibly one of the kindest bits out there. The chain conforms to the horses mouth , its really not that harsh.
Have you ever used on? I used to feel the same way until I kept hitting wall after wall with my Arab gelding. Bought one , tried to hurt my arm with it an couldnt. In order to be able to actually cut up a mouth they would have to have sharp edges or some sort of distortion to them (like a twisted wire does) They are kind because they conform to the mouth , the only thing not great about them is they kinda hang vs. setting up on the bars of the mouth.
Posts: 11409
May 2 08 9:47 AM
Posts: 33224
May 2 08 10:13 AM
Fetlock Up wrote: Aha. You are defending them because you are guilty. I've had to clean up the mess after assholes using chain bits. You are absolutely wrong about them being kind. They can and will cut up a horse's mouth.
May 2 08 10:21 AM
KingOfTheJungle04 wrote: Something sounds a bit fishy if your arab was really bad undersaddle and suddenly you shove a chain bit in his mouth and he's perfect? Chances are it was so harsh that yes, it definitely prevented him from acting up. If that's the shortcut of training you wanted to take, who am I to stop you? That's your choice, your horse. He for 12 years of his life was ridden in a TT (before we bought him) by kids at an inner city camp. He flunked out because he became dangerous. Regular snaffles didnt do it an at the time I didnt have a frenchlink. Tried the chain bit an he suddenly didnt hate having a bit in his mouth , cues were suddenly understandable for him. And I disagree with your statement that the bit would have to be sharp or distorted to cause injury. Long before I owned my gelding, when he was roughly a year and a half, the barn owner had the bright idea to lunge him. Since he was headstrong she threw a liver pool driving bit on him. And then aggressively lunged him for 20 minutes. I arrived at that time, saw what the hell she was doing, came up with an excuse and offered to untack him and take him inside for her. Once alone in the barn, I carefully took that bit off and his mouth was bloody. Thankfully no teeth had been broken, but his bars were rubbed raw, his mouth was sore and from then on he'd panic and freak out if he so much as saw a bridle. OK, rambled alittle there but my point was - his mouth got bloody off a "simple" straight bar, so I don't need a creative imagination to figure out the chain issue. ANY bit can do that. All you proved was what matters most is the hands that the bit is in. As for the liverpool , they commonly have a serrated edge that rests against the bars/tongue. The straight up an down shanks are also a detrimental factor. Maybe you should run a thin chain over your tongue for an hour, then come back and tell us it's not cut or even sore. Maybe you should be better educated about the mechanics of bits an there uses before speaking. Once again your speaking out of context. Nowhere did she say she did for an hour.
May 2 08 10:23 AM
ponypimpmomma wrote: On the chain issue... VERY dangerous. A chain is nothing like a bit and any bit that's harsher than a chain has no business on a horse. Look at a chain bit , nine outta ten of them very closely resemble a chain shank lead. If you have ever seen the face of a horse who got away from someone with a chain over it's nose or in it's mouth you will not repeat that behavior again. If they step on that lunge or get away they can reduce their face or mouth to chopmeat in seconds. It's really not a good idea. Agreed. But a loose horse can cause serious amount of torque on its own body with a chain. Then again... losing one's temper rarely solves anything other than making one feel momentarily better. I'm older than the bunch of ya *LOL* and I had my share of pissy PMS I'll show that horse who's boss days in my younger years. I regret them all. They never did a thing to foward the transformation of a horse's behavior. Agreed. No matter what the horse does punishment should be swift and just, not prolonged and out of proportion to the infraction. Agreed.
Posts: 8884
May 2 08 11:07 AM
May 2 08 11:10 AM
sunridge1 wrote: Confirmed kickers and halter pullers. Lordosis. Can someone please explain, "space invading"? Why wouldn't you want your horse close to you? Mary
May 2 08 11:21 AM
Posts: 638
May 2 08 11:30 AM
sunridge1 wrote: I ask because my horses are quite a large breed and many are intimidated by them. They also love people. The boys are the worst for attention getting but if I want them out of my space I just wave them away or growl. They know what it means. So do these "space invaders" not respond readily to "get away", or are people just afraid getting stepped on etc? Or are all my horses space invaders and most people would hate them? Mary
Yeah a true space invader won't leave you alone even when asked.
Some days life just hits you harder than you expected.
May 2 08 11:40 AM
Posts: 268
May 2 08 12:56 PM
Posts: 3344
May 2 08 2:03 PM
May 2 08 7:57 PM
See N Spots wrote: Pity parties ................. Cowgirl the hell up and do something that makes a difference in the world - no matter how small it is.
I have never agreed with you more then I do right now.
Posts: 22228
May 2 08 9:39 PM
Glad I flipped to this page so I could find another thing you are absolutely wrong on...TRD is right they are not harsh at all as they don't touch the bars at all & pretty much work like a snaffle.A lot of ropers & working cowboys use them because when your really doing something ya can forget about being light & get in their mouths more than ya intend to so they use um to save the mouths....Just ONE more thing that looks nasty to the uninformed....
Posts: 2909
May 2 08 9:58 PM
pdj47 wrote: Glad I flipped to this page so I could find another thing you are absolutely wrong on...TRD is right they are not harsh at all as they don't touch the bars at all & pretty much work like a snaffle.A lot of ropers & working cowboys use them because when your really doing something ya can forget about being light & get in their mouths more than ya intend to so they use um to save the mouths....Just ONE more thing that looks nasty to the uninformed....
Thanks, PD. Let's give Jackie some credit...from what I've read of her posts here, she is a good hand and knows how to use a chain without causing harm. Same for TRD. I haven't used a chain bit but I do like to use either a a French Link snaffle or a 'dog bone link snaffle' and can't see that there would be much difference, as long as the chain mouthpiece has large, smooth, flat links.
Posts: 2785
May 2 08 10:16 PM
FFV FFV FFV
Posts: 1573
May 2 08 11:49 PM
May 3 08 4:01 AM
cursivenight wrote: Perhaps, like all bits, its how they are used that matters? I know relatively nothing about bits, I freely admit that, but from what I do know, that's the conclusion I've gathered. Now I certainly wouldn't be slipping a lead line chain into my horses mouth, nor would I really want to consider a chain bit unless I thought it would benefit my horse immensely. I think there are a lot of options, as a lot of bits can do the same thing IN THE RIGHT HANDS, or close to the same thing. What exactly, does a chain bit do? Like, why would you put your horse in one? I've heard of them before but never seen one used.
Posts: 5659
May 3 08 5:52 AM
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